Monstrous
Apocalypse Soon => Religions, Cults & Sects => Topic started by: rave phillaphia on September 09, 2010, 07:31:25 PM
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http://abcnews.go.com/US/pastor-terry-jones-cancels-koran-burning-calls-ground/story?id=11594495 (http://abcnews.go.com/US/pastor-terry-jones-cancels-koran-burning-calls-ground/story?id=11594495)
I am glad he coped out. It is completely wrong and ignorant of Islamic religion. Christians aggervate me sometimes. It shows us that we are just as bad as the radicals on 9/11. Oh by the way it wasn't a mosque they were going to build. It was a community center and yes it was in radius of ground zero but it wasn't on ground zero it was about two blocks away.
Considering that the Koran says to "respect the peoples of the bible" which includes the Jews and Christians and we have to ignor that. Also just to say that yes some empire did persecute christians and jews later but that was the Empires not Islam! It wasn't like how the Catholic church persecuted the Jews in mideval Europe and the Muslims in the Crusades for over 600 years and sort of still continue today in other forms.
Sorry it has really been bugging me today. Religious intolerance is one of lead causes that we do not have peace on this God Forsaken planent and people think that their prejudices will be ignored by Gods or whatever comes next judgement. I really really wish Americans would study before making grand actions like this in order to 'proove a point' even though their knowledge is based on falsified pretenses and beliefs because they choose to be ignorant. I think Americans need to research before being judgemental and hateful.
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That is true, They all come from the same texts and they all share the same roots. I wonder how religion has come so far and yet most of the people who actually belong to those religions never see that. Some times the world astounds me.
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Agreed... However I do feel that building an Islamic structure within even a few miles of Ground Zero is like throwing salt into someones wounds.
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Agreed... However I do feel that building an Islamic structure within even a few miles of Ground Zero is like throwing salt into someones wounds.
Why?
I'm pretty sure there were Muslims that die in the attack as well..... and I don't mean the attackers..... I mean Muslims working in or visiting WTC.
Would you say the same if it was a Buddhist or Hindu building? You are prejudiced, due to the attackers being Muslims. Are we also to prohibit Christian buildings in Jerusalem, due to the crimes committed by the Crusaders? Don't confuse the faith of the criminal with the crime.
very much true, sadly, most people don't think this way :(
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Agreed... However I do feel that building an Islamic structure within even a few miles of Ground Zero is like throwing salt into someones wounds.
I also agree it is in poor taste. I don't think the people of Selma would like the KKK headquarters next to the Edmund Pettus Bridge!
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First, Waco and Jonestown were both caused by cult leaders and those who followed them blindly, much like almost every christian follows the bible blindly.
In all honesty, to be fair, let's just burn all of the religious texts for all three religions. Then perhaps we will have peace on Earth and nothing but good will for each other.
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Good idea moloch, but then they find something else to kill each other over.
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The problem with the Waco and Jonestown is that it was completely religious based and fear. The 9/11 attacks, yes were by extreme radicals that are not even recognized by Islam, but it was more of a political statement than anything else. We, as Americans, misunderstand and tend to catergorize all human beings, so when these radicals did this we said they were Muslim radicals and forget that they actually are part of a radical governmental social movement. Yes religions do play a role in suffering and giving way to 'ethical reasoning' as to why they have the right to do this, but it is because leaders shape what the people believe.
Similar to how Bush said for us to go to Iraq. We were mad at all middle eastern peoples and blamed Muslims for our time of grief. What we didn't realize was that we were manipulated the full truth about the weapons of mass destruction and followed it for completely political gains. If you go to many countries, they now call Iraq our 'colony' not an 'independent and struggling system which we are trying to form, so that we can leave it in peace'. We have placed our own corporate companies in Iraq for natural resources due to economic and political gains, for those few in power. Now it has hurt us more than benefitted us but that is because we do not recognize what we are doing in a whole because Americans can't be colonizing corporate leaders.
I would like to make a point that one of the professors said on a ending note about 9/11, "Since that day of 9/11, it was tragic and we do mourn the loss of those victims, but we should also remember that 9/11 hasn't ended it is still going on today with all the innocent, soldiers, and even the radicals themselves are being killed, so let us remember all those who have lost their lives, because not recognizing what is the really going on here will lead to this event never ending and still continuing on past these 9 long hard years."
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The 9/11 attacks, yes were by extreme radicals that are not even recognized by Islam, but it was more of a political statement than anything else.
When government and religion are one and the same, can a political statement be considered solely as such?
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Thank you Ladygriffin, that is the point that I am trying to get across to Americans. We shouldn't blame all of Islam for one small group of people.
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Thank you Ladygriffin, that is the point that I am trying to get across to Americans. We shouldn't blame all of Islam for one small group of people.
Christians aggervate me sometimes. It shows us that we are just as bad as the radicals on 9/11.
I really really wish Americans would study before making grand actions like this in order to 'proove a point' even though their knowledge is based on falsified pretenses and beliefs because they choose to be ignorant. I think Americans need to research before being judgemental and hateful.
Please don't blame all Christians for one man's actions. I, as a Christian, have never tried to kill thousands of innocent people working in a building. I am not sure what "falsified pretenses" you are talking about, but the new testament teaches patience and tolerance of others. The Taliban and other tribal religious groups of Islam are not. Please show me who in the Middle East practices pure Islamic principles. Even Mohammad spread Islam through conquest. As others have stated all three religions have the same roots and have engaged in military practices in the name of religion.
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Didn't the pastor get a call from the FBI? If I remember correctly.
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The Florida Today (the local paper out here) only said that he decided to call it off... Although I was at work there might have been more to that article I'm not sure. I'll look it up for you though. :)
'Defense Secretary Robert Gates took the extraordinary step of calling Jones personally' - Associated Press
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100909/ap_on_re_us/quran_burning (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100909/ap_on_re_us/quran_burning)
That is one of the many links I found concerning the burnings being called off. :)
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I just remember reading it in the paper at the gas station I work at.
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I found it here at work and reread it, and that's what I found. The defense secretary called and now the pastor is saying he feels God was telling him not to do it. Lol
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And this is why, though baptised catholic, I renounce it and all denominations of it.
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Yeah I hear you on that. There were still some isolated incidents of public book burnings, some not far from ground zero site.
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My point is that you can't blame a faith for crimes committed by it's followers. And you can't brand ALL followers of a faith for crimes committed by a small group of individuals within that faith.
Hmmm, so we can't lay any blame at the feet of those who knew what was coming and failed to act? We should hold blameless the many, many, many people who supported in some way those actions? We cannot call to account each and every Muslim who has refused for whatever reason to denounce terrorism?
Actions speak louder than words. Inaction positively screams into one's face. These people who have refused to stand for what is right and true, regardless of religious background, are just as guilty as the perpetrators. Oh, and not just the people, no; the government as well, because the government and the religion in many of these nations goes hand in hand; in some cases the religion IS the government.
So, you tell me, where is the flaw in my logic? Before you start though, keep in mind, I have never said I hate any one group more than another. In fact, I have stated numerous times that I hate everyone equally. This thread just happens to be about Islam and its followers.
As for the scattered book burnings, the details surrounding this "pastor's" dubious change of heart; I'm sure that god had nothing to do with it. They probably threatened to pull his 501 (c)(3) status. That would mean he'd have to pay all of the taxes on that money his church gets. Though this would free him to make political statements.
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Let's just say religion is right and the people who misunderstand it is wrong. They doesn't get the real meaning and mislead to other bad thinking. Since i am living in a Islamic country, i find those thinking of those people are really... :crazy:
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Oh? Please, do enlighten me as to how believing in anything other than one's Self and your own innate abilities and capacities is right? Explain to me how any being who would claim to be omnipotent and omniscient would or could claim to wish to be worshiped and sought out? Why would it stoop to help the least of its creations? Why would it create something with all of the potential that humans have, and then not force it to do for itself first before helping it?
I can tell you now, it wouldn't. No god helps the butterfly from its cocoon because to do so would doom the butterfly to an early demise. So it is with us humans. Assuming god is a real being, and not a metaphysical construct to give us an excuse to be ignorant, then this god isn't even watching us now, it's already moved on to better things... which would be anything but us.
Really though, please show us how any religion is right and good for anything other than a socio-economic welfare system.
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Thank you Ladygriffin, that is the point that I am trying to get across to Americans. We shouldn't blame all of Islam for one small group of people.
Christians aggervate me sometimes. It shows us that we are just as bad as the radicals on 9/11.
I really really wish Americans would study before making grand actions like this in order to 'proove a point' even though their knowledge is based on falsified pretenses and beliefs because they choose to be ignorant. I think Americans need to research before being judgemental and hateful.
Please don't blame all Christians for one man's actions. I, as a Christian, have never tried to kill thousands of innocent people working in a building. I am not sure what "falsified pretenses" you are talking about, but the new testament teaches patience and tolerance of others. The Taliban and other tribal religious groups of Islam are not. Please show me who in the Middle East practices pure Islamic principles. Even Mohammad spread Islam through conquest. As others have stated all three religions have the same roots and have engaged in military practices in the name of religion.
I am not blaiming all Christians. I am catholic and I know that they have done wrong in the past but they strive to do better. I am just trying to say that we shouldn't blame the whole lot of Muslims because it is not what they teach. In the Koran it says to respect the peoples of the bible which include the Jews and Christians. Mohammad went out on a political move because the town threatened his life and so he was exiled and converted another city. It is what people do with the teachings that gets me. If I do recall the New Testament, which many Christains try to do today, say that all other religions are wrong and that they have to 'save' these people from damnation. Is that religious tolerance? Did the terrorists go and kill people to try to convert them? No they went for political actions and it just so happens that they believe by doing this that they will have a place in heaven afterwards for their 'sacrifice'. This is the misunderstanding I am talking about. It wasn't an attack against religion it was an attack against America. If it was an attack against religion, they would be attacking more than just us.
I am not saying this is a religious attack, because it is not. It is a political move that has religious undertones because that is the culture they come from. The thing that bothers me is when certain Christian groups try to make it a religious attack for their own benefit. It is just ignorant to not know what is really going on in this situation. And what bothers me worse is that people don't really want to know what is happening or what has happened because they don't want to research it. They wait for the news to tell them what is going on, which has a political and sadly a religious bias against Muslims.
And Ladygriffin has a point. We can blame all those who fail to take a stance in this situation. By not having any opinion or going with the majority on a basis that they don't know what is going on is what continues this event. We continue to hate and strive for trying to 'colonize' other middle eastern cultures for the right of the upper classes and government to have political and material wealth, and the misinformed hatred just shows that we are blind. The only way to end this situation is to understand what is going on, be tolerant of the other groups, try to work with the groups to ensure the countries and people will have some sort of governmental stability, and to just forgive everyone for what has happend but not forget. But we can't do that right because every time we do it ends up becoming a dictatorship because we want wealth from that country and in order to do that we have to 'regulate' what they do.
This is why I hate politics but not religion. Religion is used as a tool to manipulate people into believing that what they are doing is right but it is the political realm which actually controls what is going on. Ex: they made the excuse to go on crusades in order to 'save' people. Reality: They went on the crusades to gain material wealth, people, and land to control. Same thing today just covered up by religious undertones or I should say overtones and people who wont go and find out what is going on.