[Muerte]

interestingly enough all our answers are generally all the same...learn before you jump from a frying pan into the literary fire.

  Interestingly enough the eager young would prefer to hear what they wish and not what is said.

[Kadesh]

interestingly enough all our answers are generally all the same...learn before you jump from a frying pan into the literary fire.

  Interestingly enough the eager young would prefer to hear what they wish and not what is said.

 Too bad 'young' has absolutely nothing to do with age.

[Romise]

i am not quibbling, it is a simple question. Lucifer is not a demon, my question was who the worst demon was in your opinion, not humanity, not an angel, i wanna know who u think is the worst of the worst of demonkind is?

I have to disagree with this statement... Lucifer is an angel therefore he is a demon.

[Kadesh]

i am not quibbling, it is a simple question. Lucifer is not a demon, my question was who the worst demon was in your opinion, not humanity, not an angel, i wanna know who u think is the worst of the worst of demonkind is?

I have to disagree with this statement... Lucifer is an angel therefore he is a demon.

 Uhhhmmm.... last I checked, angels and demons were not the same thing, Romise.....

[Romise]

Well then our understandings are off. My understanding was demon's were fallen angels.

[Muerte]

Well then our understandings are off. My understanding was demon's were fallen angels.

  And the above statement is were your understanding is off.  Your thinking that they still have a connection to their past profession.  Think of it in this sense.  A police officer looses his job, is he still a police officer?  Can he still ticket you, arrest you, put you into prison?  No?  Same for the Fallen, they are no longer angels.

[Romise]

Were not talking about professions here though, although that wouldn't change either just because they turned... were talking about a race. It would be like me saying I'm a dog, I may start running around on all fours, sniffing everything in sight, pissing on things, but I'm still a human. The same goes for demons, they are still angels, just with a different purpose. 

Of course all of this is mere conjecture, isnt it?   We are just swapping opinions at this point.

I have a different idea of how to really find out about this, lets go direct to the horses mouth.

Lets ask the relevant parties direct.

So who here is is contact with either angels demons or God on a conversational level?

Any answers we get we can post here. Along with what we did to find out and a record of the experience.
 
Seems to be the most logical solution to this issue dont you think?

[Angelus]

I get what you mean. The fallen are still angels. Just not angels of the lord anymore. I guess. So stripped of their devine powers and cast down they would need to rely on the powers that god made them with, or they learned rather than the power they were gifted by heaven. This explains why they have different forms and abilities than that of the angels.

[Romise]

That's a bingo! lol Inglorious Bastards anybody? 

[Kadesh]

 I have plenty of contact with demons, but it's not the kind where we sit down and have a conversation. However... that does sound like a decent idea......

[jordyn]

considering demons are greek deamons, i don't think they'd be the same thing as angels, as western idealizations understand...we know where angels come from but aside from a rare few like satan who's actually mentioned in the bible and demonstrated who and what he is, everything comes from greco roman myth and a few even earlier religions that were in direct competition with the israelites, hell isn't a place for souls in the bible,  belial was a god of the caananites i believe, and ghenna is a refuse fire pit that was used to toss away diseased garbage, a more appropriate symbol for what early christians and jews perceived about a life without their god, not a fluffy cloud place full of harps or a fiery hole with levels and evil creatures tearing apart your soul...that's all western idealism.

translation is sucky...especially when the romans got their hands in the pie.

[Moloch]

I look forward to this, as per my usual.

[Muerte]

Were not talking about professions here though, although that wouldn't change either just because they turned... were talking about a race. It would be like me saying I'm a dog, I may start running around on all fours, sniffing everything in sight, pissing on things, but I'm still a human. The same goes for demons, they are still angels, just with a different purpose. 

  First off let's start with this statement.

 

It would be like me saying I'm a dog, I may start running around on all fours, sniffing everything in sight, pissing on things, but I'm still a human.

  I want you to go to the Theran section and make  similar statement to them.  To be so full of yourself to say that no matter what a persons belief is they will only ever be "Human"in your Great and Almighty opinion, well that would be the epitome of conceit would it not?  You will find no mere humans here and to make such assumption will earn you no understanding among those in this community.

  That's only the beginning however to this reply however.  Do you know what the definition of an Angel is?  Did you even bother to look it up or did you just assume you knew?  Hold on a minute, I'll answer that for you.  YOU assumed you knew what YOU were talking about.  Here, let me show you what I found after a mere 10 sec look.

  http://www.answers.com/topic/angel
  http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/angel
  http://www.yourdictionary.com/angel
  http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/angel

  What are they referred to as?  Celestial beings?  WOW, imagine that, Angels are Celestial beings.  What does that mean exactly?  Please allow me.  It means that "We" have no idea what they really are but we do know what they do.  I'll repeat myself, "We know what they do."  Now what do we call what it is a person/entity does in service to others?  Why we call it a "Job" don't we?  So being an Angel is a "Job" isn't it?  Now I know some people can hold two jobs but I doubt the Almighty would allow that do you? Soooo can Angels and Demons be one and the same?  I will let someone else answer this.  Before you answer I want to point out the closing statement.

 

The same goes for demons, they are still angels

  Think about what I have just stated and ponder on Romises' Great and Profound statement, then get back to me.

  P.S.  I know I have yet to touch upon the Fallen, but this is enough for now (perhaps too much) for you to chew on.  The original point was wether Angels and Demons were the same.

[chaoticpsyche]

Wow! I don't think I've ever seen a post where Muerte wasn't nice... O___O...

I do have to admit it though Muerte does make a good point the angels that have fallen from the grace of God are no longer angels. Even me, who hasn't been to church in *does math in my head* 15-ish years knows that. The fact that you stated that they were the same makes no sense to me, and I wonder where you got the information that they were. O_o I want to read it, that is if you didn't assume your opinion and state it as a fact.