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Jesus or Isa

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MagnusCrane:
I decided to bring up this new topic after reading another one called "Spear of Destiny." After reading all of what people had to say, I got wondering about the spear of destiny. Throughout time and memorial, the spear has been a great research. Hell, with all the wars that passed, the so-called spear has been what was used as a symbol of hope and the company standard, similar to Julius Caesar standard of his eagle. To get to my point I starting asking now, what I was asking myself before. The possibility is to be considered that Jesus may not have ever died on the cross. Therefore that would make the spear of destiny, shroud of Turin, and every other relic pertaining to Jesus a false. According to my own research and the research of other colleagues alike, we discovered that there is more information and evidence of Jesus never dieing on the cross, than there is of him actually being on it. I discovered that he may have been referred to as Isa. Now the only thing about that is according to Jesus' background, he was of a Hebrew descent. And since the name Isa is actually Arabic, there is a possibility that he may not have been born with the name Isa. But for sure it also could not be Jesus, if we are to use a Hebrew-Judaic language, because there isn't a letter "J" in the Hebrew-Judaic alphabet. Be that as it may, with the information I have acquired over time, I am inclined to believed that the man known as the Biblical Jesus never died on the cross.   :-D  :wink:  0:)  :laugh:

matthew321:
OK there is a gap here I do not think you are aware of. The bible was originally written in Hebrew. Then translated to Greek and then to English. There have been a few things lost from that. It would of been better to go from Hebrew to English but that did not happen.
The point is that there is no name Jesus in the Hebrew version. The original version gives the son of god (Jesus) the name Yashua (like Joshua but with a y, "yo-shoe-uh") This is the original name and there is no J in it, since it is original Hebrew.

They also mention this on "secrets of the bible codes revealed" I saw this somewhere and this was also mentioned. Try looking it up.

LeXtruX:
I have to go with matt on this one.
though I do doubt the whole business of Jesus' actions anyway

rave phillaphia:
actually matthew most of the new testament was written in Greek, none of which written in Hebrew so it is relavant. Some was written in Aramaic. Hebrew wasn't the common language then except for the priestly community. It wasn't until after the exile and beginning of the medeval period did the Jews start to pick Hebrew back up and even then they didn't use it as much except in the Eastern Europe area which developed into Yiddish.

I have heard about this idea, but to be clear there were many people who were crucified at this time period. So many in fact that we can find evidence. He may not have been up on a cross but more of a tree (which orthodox communities in Israel believe he was crucified on an olive tree).

The interesting part about the 'spear of destiny' (mind you got that name due to pop culture and movies like Constantine) has a piece that dates to the time of christ. The core of the 'spear' holds an iron nail that dates to that time period. Now the rest of the spear is not from that period whatsoever, and in the medeval times they would add things, same with the shroud, we know that they added pieces on the corners when it would get damaged over time. Just basic wear and tear.

Also yes 'Jesus' is latin for Yashua, also if you translate into english is Joshua. So it is likely that he would have had a name like Yashua or maybe Isa, if his family took up aramaic names because that was their native language NOT HEBREW. Expecially considering that they were the lowest of classes, a carpenter, sacrificing doves at the temple is the lowest of sacrifices, etc...

But we have already known this for years just people are so stuck on the symbolism of Jesus on a Cross with a latin name and the list goes on. Yes there are flaws in the new testament but it is how it is. One can point those flaws out but only looking at specific texts also flaws the view point. So then you have to bring in apaphrical texts and yadi yada. It is a lot of work....

Sorry to burst bubbles about information but sadly this is my field of study. It is ironic because I research pre-Judaism period and have to learn about this time period because that is all people are interested in. They always forget that there are older periods than Jesus. lol geez people.  %*)

And one more thing, It is actually more probable that Jesus did exist because of other famous 'healers' lived in this time period as well. It was a very common thing that was made uncommon when Jesus died and came back from the dead and then accended to heaven....

MagnusCrane:
Well now, it is nice to see we have a lot in common rave phillaphia  in our school of thought. I have to say that I agree with most of what you said. Now I say most because it is getting late and I am tired, so will have to reread what you said thoroughly tomorrow. However, your points are valid, since Aramaic was a more popular language spoken, most like the probability would be that he could have been given a name of that language. As far as the movie Constantine, I never saw the movie. But I will not lie, I originally heard of the spear of destiny from Japanese animation many years ago about 1997. Its called "Spirit Warrior, Peacock King" That was what stuck something for me which lead me to research the spear in the first place. Now as far as the other dude is talking about, I think needs to get his facts straight. Matthew321 said the Bible was written all in Hebrew. OK well according to who, and where does come up with that. What's his proof and how can back that one up or substantiate it? I could continue on and explain how the Bible was once a compilation and was not all revealed at the same time. Over time fragment were put together to form what are calling now the Bible. Please explain Matthew321, in what language was the Books of Moses were written in, and who now have the original Ark of the Covenant? I bet you probably believe that there's only Ten Commandments as well? Good luck buddy. By the way rave phillaphia, if you are an archaeologist, then I would like to speak top you privately, and hopefully and maybe eventually, exchange information. You are by far an interesting person to converse with. I really mean that now. When and where was your last dig? I have one coming in about 6 months. Anyhow, I don't I ever mentioned that Jesus may not have existed. Hell if someone were to make such a claim, it would no different then saying he did exist. The facts still remain as such; the so-called Biblical Jesus live in a time that we of this time were not around for. And we can argue his existence until we are blue in the face. But in reality, none of us has a direct experience of Jesus of his time, and therefore there isn't we can't say for sure he ever existed. All we have are books, scrolls, manuscripts of him, which could have easily been forged and confabulated for a more sinister and twisted purpose. If Jesus really existed, then produce the evidence. Remember, quoting scriptures won't prove anything, it only proves that someone out there wrote a book. Scriptures proves that words in the Bible are really there. But without any of us being in the those ancient times, we can't prove anything.

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