Author Topic: "does everyone go to heaven?"  (Read 4872 times)

jordyn

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"does everyone go to heaven?"
« on: January 07, 2009, 04:52:29 PM »
it seems a pretty straightforward question, going from a contemporary christian approach...but historically, biblically and traditionally; who goes where, how does it happen and how do you explain the claim to past lives?
"The world that God made is inherently comprised of relationships, symmetries, analogia, anagogy, poetic wisdom. Thus is the language of symbolism."

Raziel
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2009, 01:11:07 AM »
Perhaps the whole Jesus ascension thing was meant to be taken litterally?

Ascending to the sky sounds like an abduction ^_^

but seriously though, if we take the kundalini/surat shabd yoga view, reincarnation happens because said person is not "unlighted" enough to ascend planes.
In this view there are 4 planes/grand divisions of existance.

Pinda- us
Anda- lowest of the heavens which is discribed as the powerhouse of the physical universe.
Brahmanda- place where bram/gods/allah-yahweh-spaghetti monster  resides. this was thought to be the highest point of existence by the old rishis (accd to the wierd book i got)

And

Sat Desh- translation, true country. plane of pure spirit, indescribable, infinite, incomprehensible to the human mind, Seat of the Creator. blah blah blah.(insert dictionary of praises here)


Basically, dem pplz dat meditate and study from a mashta (yesh  i iz mutilatingz me wurdz on purpoze)
dey, get real good at dis stuff and touch wan plase an go ap.

Our wurld dey sey is da place wit da baad juu juu.

That is to say the place with the densest matter. and the way to ascension is the denial of self by good works, and thoughts as these " deflate the ego" or something.


Of course i could be wrong. can a real follower of this thought-school please stand up? I don't wanna hafta read the book to give nina answers.   
The closer you get to light, the greater your shadow becomes.
But donít be afraid. And donít forget...
You hold the mightiest weapon of all.
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Nina
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2009, 04:36:32 AM »
I think that eventually, everybody does. We go trough circles (reincarnation) until we learn what we are supposed to (insert Raz words here) and then we go to upper level.... or something like that.  :roll:

Raziel
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2009, 05:18:16 AM »
I think nina's loopy  :-D
(don't worry we still love you..... you crazy alien-conspiracy theorist  nut job ^_^)
The closer you get to light, the greater your shadow becomes.
But donít be afraid. And donít forget...
You hold the mightiest weapon of all.
-Kingdom Hearts

Rainbow

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2009, 06:44:27 AM »
Correct me if Iam wrong, someone told me once that reincarnation goes through the 12 different zodiac signs. He told me that once you arrive to sign Pisces, your soul does not return to reincarnate. Then the soul move to the next level.
All That Is Now, All That Is Gone & All That's To Come!!!

Raziel
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2009, 06:57:31 AM »
My friend. people have different ways of interpreting a single idea.


For example, people believe that if you've accumulated enough karmic debt, you turn into an animal.(in your next life)
And some people, just for the heck of it decide that reincarnation turns you into a strand of the spaghetti  monster. but then again. Bleh.

Whatever you believe, one thing is certain.
None of us really have a clue.  those who say otherwise have their own beliefs and i think they should also start believing that the crusades were a successful assault against the Islamic religious in defense of the holy land, and not a politically motivated campaign by inbred politicians masquerading as men of the cloth against the ottoman empire. (Yes i know the first one was a sucess and all, but think about the children!!.........'s crusade)
The closer you get to light, the greater your shadow becomes.
But donít be afraid. And donít forget...
You hold the mightiest weapon of all.
-Kingdom Hearts

Nina
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2009, 10:09:29 AM »
I think nina's loopy  :-D
(don't worry we still love you..... you crazy alien-conspiracy theorist  nut job ^_^)

Well, thank you... I guess....  :roll:

And that is sure, we cannot know for sure until we get there. We can have faith and instinct, but that isnt enough for some... thus they feel alone and like there is nothing after... I pitty them, really.

jordyn

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2009, 02:25:49 PM »
i don't think hindus are that big on astrology

http://hinduism.about.com/od/basics/a/karma.htm

at least not how the west has come to embrace it.

http://hinduism.about.com/library/weekly/extra/bl-zodiac.htm
 
astrology has everything to do with where the stars, were when  you were born nothing about when or  where you die  and it really has very little to do with the concept of heaven.  if we were talking nirvana then there'd be a connection, but neo pagan incarnate beliefs are absolutely nothing like the eastern culture they stole it from.
"The world that God made is inherently comprised of relationships, symmetries, analogia, anagogy, poetic wisdom. Thus is the language of symbolism."

Nina
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2009, 02:38:40 PM »
Oh, my dear, but you are wrong. There is no older nor more exact astrology than Jotish.


Ok made a new topic about
Jotish astrology
« Last Edit: January 08, 2009, 02:44:14 PM by Nina »

Loki

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2009, 02:26:09 PM »
I think there are many astrological systems but it is hard to say which one appeared first - probably the vedic one.
The greatest trick the devil ever played was convincing the world that he did not exist.Ē - Charles Baudelaire (French and monstrous poet).

Nina
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2009, 02:36:08 PM »
Yes, thats the Jyotish one.

Ryobi

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2009, 03:28:37 PM »
You know, if karma exists as the means to how you will be reincarnated and karma is based on what you do and your own will then that means it can be warped. If we figure out exactly how much good karma is needed to end up as 'what' then we could come back as whatever we want to.

I'm gonna come back as a mumbai taxi driver, no! Linda Goodman.. wait! A tree  8-).

When I hear somebody sigh, "Life is hard," I am always tempted to ask, "Compared to what?"

Raziel
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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2009, 05:07:31 PM »
You know, if karma exists as the means to how you will be reincarnated and karma is based on what you do and your own will then that means it can be warped. If we figure out exactly how much good karma is needed to end up as 'what' then we could come back as whatever we want to.

I'm gonna come back as a mumbai taxi driver, no! Linda Goodman.. wait! A tree  8-).



Perhaps since karma is partially based on self perception, we can't use the "ive done enough, let me in " card. it  might even give us a negative effect for trying to manipulate the universal cycle of souls or something ^_^
The closer you get to light, the greater your shadow becomes.
But donít be afraid. And donít forget...
You hold the mightiest weapon of all.
-Kingdom Hearts

Ryobi

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2009, 01:48:49 AM »
Well if you want to use karma to get to heaven but I don't know if that choice lies with us. The notion of heaven is very different to the notion of reincarnation, it doesn't seem to fit together, unless there is a way to accumulate so much good karma that you are reincarnated as a heavenly body...?
When I hear somebody sigh, "Life is hard," I am always tempted to ask, "Compared to what?"

Daemonin

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Re: "does everyone go to heaven?"
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2009, 05:29:33 AM »
Reincarnation can work with "heaven" in the sense that one can reincarnate time and time again until they reach their potential to go to "heaven."