[KubeSix]

You are right, though. Lots of people use their childhood as an excuse for any and everything. They commit a crime, hey they had a hard childhood. They end up living on the street? Well hey, it's not their fault if they had a hard childhood... Sometimes it just doesn't even remotely make any sense how that would excuse anything... Oh well, some people need pity, others have pride.

[Kadesh]

 People are so ridiculous. Celebrities use that excuse a lot. "I'm a drug-addicted dirty whore because my parents didn't buy me that toy I wanted."  Shut the f#ck up.

[KubeSix]

Luckily, celebrities like that tend to die quickly. If not, we'd be doomed...

[Kadesh]

 Not quickly enough to keep them off my radar. And I don't watch the news and hardly any TV... so that's a chore. 

[Ryobi]

I'm sorry but people are not ridiculous, they are simply their own person. One may not understand the motives of another but that does not mean they should disregard them as 'excuses' based on how sappy or ludicrous they sound.

Emotional and mental pain is the same, no matter how it is felt and therefore should be taken into account, soothed and healed no matter the reasons it is felt.

If someone is addicted to drugs, then she is addicted to drugs and should be helped, regardless. If he committed a crime because he had a hard childhood, then that makes whatever affected him in his youth even more serious within the community. That man should be taken to a support group where he can be assissted in carrying the burdens of those memories. Instead of being dismissed or thrown in jail, situations where those burdens will only grow heavier.

If it is an excuse, then why are they using it? To lie about such a thing shows trauma or mental issues anyway, which should be addressed instead.

[Kadesh]

 You're misunderstanding what I"m saying, Ryobi. I'm talking about people that use it as a crutch an excuse to get by with things. Not people that are genuinely affected by things, but are still trying to be a good person and working toward overcoming them. The people that are working toward understanding themselves and overcoming obstacles are the strong ones we were talking about earlier. The others? Weak and pathetic... the ones I'm talking about now.

[Ryobi]

I do understand Kadesh, many seem to misunderstand the true motives of people as simply excuses, which is what I was trying to get at through that post. However, I also said that those who are using those kinds of stories as an emotional crutch, should probably seek help as well, as that really isn't a mentally sound action. 

[Kadesh]

 You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Take all the addicts you want to rehab and therapy.... how many of them actually recover??

[Ryobi]

The point is to try and to keep on trying. Some do recover, hope that in time and with constant pushing in that direction, they will as well or at least learn that by using 'trauma' as an excuse, they only get into more unbearable situations.

[Kadesh]

 I would love to say that I'd push anyone in the right direction. I would love to say I'm that much of a humanitarian. But the truth is, most people only have themselves to blame for the situations they're in. If it truly wasn't someone's fault that they were where they were... then I'd help. Gladly.

[Ryobi]

I guess, how I see it is that, if it's their own fault that they have gotten themselves into a situation. Then they are the obstacle that needs to be overcome if they are to live in peace again. Who am I to deny a fellow person that feeling? Something I seek so strongly myself.

It's not a selfless cause, it's only fair.

I see where you're coming from as well though, tough and practical frame of mind that one. I'm sure you'd be able to help as well.

[Angelus]

Kadesh is right Ryobi. Im sorry, you obviously want to see the good in people and I love that theres still people like you in the world. But some people dont want help. They just want an excuse for attention and to fail but have someone else to blame. You hear it all the time. "Rehab failed me!". No. You failed rehab. Theres a difference. People would say its a cry for help or attention and because of this the person needs psychiatric help. Im goin to tell you a personal story of mine.

I have an aunt (not actualy my aunt but a family friend) who used to crave attention. Off anyone who would listen. She was ill with every seasonal disease imaginable. No matter how bad your cold was, she had the flu. One day she announced to her husband that she had been throwing up in the toilet after every meal on purpose because she felt unloved. This, I know was a lie. He loved her an amazing amount. She didnt work from the day they were married and never kept the home. He cooked and cleaned and such. One day she started putting on alot of weight. I mean ALOT of weight. When her mother died she told everyone that her mother used to beat her. She seeked mental help. She then went to live at a hospital for a while. Her husband is a wealthy man and got her the best of help. Her father went into a coma. She then claimed he used to rape and beat her. My uncle poured money into her healthcare. She never thanked him. Eventually she was forced to recieve ECT. Electroconvulsive Therapy or Electroshock Therapy. This went on for over ten years. In and out of hospitals. In and out of care. And now..... what started off as attention seeking ended in the only conclussion you would expect if someone spent that long in the mental hospitals and recieving ECT. She weighs in at around 300 pounds. Never leaves the house. Rocks back and forth. She dot her wish. Shes mad now. Her father died recently. She cried and mourned for the supposed rapist and abuser after years of saying she wished he would die. She was left with nothing on the will. Her recent exploits.... we caught her mailing death threats..... to herself. Claiming it was her remaining family. No one visits her now. We all gave up. You cant help the ones who dont want it.

[KubeSix]

I agree with Kadesh and Angelus. I'm not talking about those who seek help and are really in a bad situation because of something that happened to them in their childhood. Some people have severe mental scars, but you won't meet them on the street; they're in mental institutes most of the time. That rules out most of those that deserve sympathy. Some people use their hard childhoods as an excuse to be complete fark-ups and not do s**t to improve their situation. Unfortunately that happens too often and there are very few that accept to be helped.

Like Angelus said, it's good that there are people who try to see the good in others. But you can't look for something good and try to help those who won't help themselves. They've got to learn to swim for themselves, you know? Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he'll never be hungry again... Or... something like that...

Plus, to use a bad experience as an excuse rather than a way to learn a lesson isn't just being weak; it's hypocrisy. Once again, I'm not talking about those who have been traumatized or have true scars. But read the story I wrote of my childhood and now think about this: I could easily become one of those guys who go in school with a machine gun and kill everybody. Then it would be all over the news, of course, because the poor guy decided to end his life because most of his childhood was crap and take his revenge upon those who made him this way. But does that mean you should forgive their actions? People like this tend to commit suicide. But that means that they haven't learned the lesson they were taught, not that they had no chance. Will you pity a bum on the street that didn't listen in class and failed his 9th year 3 times because he didn't give a s**t about school? (I don't want you to think I have no sympathy for those who take their own lives because they couldn't take anymore; I'm saying they still had a chance and decided to take the easy way instead.)

[Ryobi]

Your aunt wasn't trying to get out of something by using her past as a crutch though Angelus. It seems like she just wanted attention, something that's free and more than easy to give away. It just happens to be, that the easiest way of getting what she wanted was through an over-developed victim complex.

If she enjoyed being that way, why stop her? If you gave her the attention she craved then chances are she would be happy for a while. You're right some people don't want to be helped in the conventional way and therefore the conventional way would do nothing. However if their situation is practically harmless, like craving attention then by all means, why not give it to her?

I know people who want the same thing as her, if you listen, focus on them and exagerrate your reactions to what the person says they become so excited and are so happy for a while. Maybe It's a coping mechanism if anything (and don't ask for what, I don't know) but if that kind of behaviour makes a person feel safe and content, then I guess it's not a challenge or an obstacle they're just facing a quirk in character and one that is easy to deal with...

[Ryobi]

This is why I've said:

If it is an excuse, then why are they using it? To lie about such a thing shows trauma or mental issues anyway, which should be addressed instead.

and

or at least learn that by using 'trauma' as an excuse, they only get into more unbearable situations.